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Laaca

Homepage

Czech republic,
29.04.2021, 13:44
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD (Users)

Yesterday I tried to use the FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD. Because I found a Dell Latitude610 notebook. And I am really dispappointed because it is something really awful. The live system is unusable, the boot process ends in the minimal configuration unable to do anything useful. No file manager is prepared and the user has no usable help. The user even has no information which disc drives are in the system.
Why the hell after so many years of FreeDOS development is it so terrible? Look for example at the Hiren Boot CD. It is the way how it should look like. THe boot ends in menu which allows to select many utilities and more sophisticated programs - everything sorted in categories and subcategories.
Or you can exit this menu system into Volkov commander or into clean DOS prompt.
OK, thought I and started to perform a full featured installation into hard disk.
Ugly FDisk (although we have a more user friendly partition tools) and then the installations. Everything takes a lot of time (installation and the Live boot).
And again. After the boot virtualy unusable system. No file manager, no infi about installed drives. No utility for getting some system information. To get some such info I had to run the text editor Blocek which is surprisingly in the basic installation and to look into its "system information" window. Why there is not bundled any sysinfo utility?
Why after the instalation for CD is only minimum applications available and for the rest I have to do i manual installations?
Nevertheless - the packages are very carelessly sorted. The "utility" subdirectory is then sorted not at all.
Many of usefull programs and utilities are missing and many of senseless programs are included. Who needs a B64 encrypter in the basic installation?
I am so disgusted that I can't continue with this text. Everything was wrong.




And I have to say that although I am using DOS for 27 years this

---
DOS-u-akbar!

RayeR

Homepage

CZ,
29.04.2021, 16:17

@ Laaca
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Heh, I never tried FD installer for any serious work, maybe once I just tried to run it in VM to see how it looks. I'm not the target user, I just installed the bare system by sys and then manually installed utilities and drivers I really need. then I deploy once made tuned installation to other PCs. Also for partitioning I use some 3rd party tools than fdisk usually.
why there are missing tools? Maybe due to licensing policy? I didn't checked but maybe only opensource / GPL is allowed on install CD so you don't get freeware like HWinfo, NSSI, VC... So the installed doesn't bother me, I'm just interested in FDkernel and freecom that gets some rare update per year so I can download recent relese separately.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

tkchia

Homepage

29.04.2021, 18:23

@ Laaca
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Hello Laaca,

Sorry to hear that. :-| I have not tried the new 1.3rc3 installation CD, though I did try installing FreeDOS 1.2 in a QEMU VM (per instructions on Wikibooks), and as far as I can remember the installation went pretty smoothly. At the end of it all, I got this:

[image]

(Again, this was with FreeDOS 1.2 in a VM.)

Thank you!

---
https://gitlab.com/tkchia · https://codeberg.org/tkchia · 😴 "MOV AX,0D500H+CMOS_REG_D+NMI"

RayeR

Homepage

CZ,
29.04.2021, 18:53

@ tkchia
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> I have not tried the new 1.3rc3 installation CD,
> though I did try installing FreeDOS 1.2 in a QEMU VM

I expect you had installed the VM from ISO than real CD drive, it's always magnitude faster as CD have slow access time that is noticable when copying a bunch of small files...

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

tkchia

Homepage

29.04.2021, 19:06

@ RayeR
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Hello RayeR,

> I expect you had installed the VM from ISO than real CD drive, it's always
> magnitude faster

Yes, that is what I did.

That aside, I am more curious about whether FreeDOS 1.3rc3 somehow got worse than FreeDOS 1.2 --- as in, whether Laaca could not even get to something like the above screen. (If so, then I would guess that something went wrong internally while 1.3rc3 was booting up.)

Thank you!

---
https://gitlab.com/tkchia · https://codeberg.org/tkchia · 😴 "MOV AX,0D500H+CMOS_REG_D+NMI"

Japheth

Homepage

Germany (South),
29.04.2021, 18:44

@ Laaca
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> The live system is unusable, the boot process ends
> in the minimal configuration unable to do anything useful. No file manager
> is prepared and the user has no usable help. The user even has no
> information which disc drives are in the system.

Your rant is rather incomprehensible to me. Why did you expect a file manager to be "prepared"? I would have expected after installation to find a simple DOS prompt, without further "help" assistance. And the prompt will at least tell you that there is a "C:" ( or "A:" ) drive - that's enough for a start, IMO.

---
MS-DOS forever!

glennmcc

Homepage E-mail

North Jackson, Ohio (USA),
29.04.2021, 19:15

@ Laaca
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> Yesterday I tried to use the FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD. Because I found
> a Dell Latitude610 notebook. And I am really dispappointed because it is
> something really awful. The live system is unusable, the boot process ends
> in the minimal configuration unable to do anything useful.

Currently downloading this live CD...

https://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stuff/freedos...tributions/1.3/previews/1.3-rc3/FD13-LiveCD.zip

Will report-back after it's burned and booted.

---
--
http://glennmcc.org/

glennmcc

Homepage E-mail

North Jackson, Ohio (USA),
29.04.2021, 20:26

@ glennmcc
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> > Yesterday I tried to use the FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD. Because I
> found
> > a Dell Latitude610 notebook. And I am really dispappointed because it is
> > something really awful. The live system is unusable, the boot process
> ends
> > in the minimal configuration unable to do anything useful.
>
> Currently downloading this live CD...
>
> https://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stuff/freedos...tributions/1.3/previews/1.3-rc3/FD13-LiveCD.zip
>
> Will report-back after it's burned and booted.
________________


I don't have any blank CDs so burned the ISO onto a DVD+RW disc


Booted it up on this Intel i5 machine which has a SATA DVD+RW drive

Chose the live option... result ...

ERROR: Unable to initialize CD-ROM drive.
A:\>
____________________________

So, booted it on the Intel DualCore machine which also has a SATA DVD+RW drive.

Chose the live option... result ...

ERROR: Unable to initialize CD-ROM drive.
A:\>
___________________________

Will now try booting it on the old-as-dirt circa 1997 P-II machine
which has an IDE/PATA DVD+RW drive.

BRB
____________________________



There we go... she's loading-up.
(quite slowly 'cus this P-II is only 266Mhz and has only 512MB of RAM)

OK.... loaded-up and sitting at....

R:\>

____

So, SATA DVD+RW drives seem to be a no-go.

__________________

Now sending this post to the FreeDOS sourceforge mailing list as-well.

---
--
http://glennmcc.org/

glennmcc

Homepage E-mail

North Jackson, Ohio (USA),
29.04.2021, 20:43

@ glennmcc
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> > > Yesterday I tried to use the FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD. Because I
> > found
> > > a Dell Latitude610 notebook. And I am really dispappointed because it
> is
> > > something really awful. The live system is unusable, the boot process
> > ends
> > > in the minimal configuration unable to do anything useful.
> >
> > Currently downloading this live CD...
> >
> >
> https://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stuff/freedos...tributions/1.3/previews/1.3-rc3/FD13-LiveCD.zip
> >
> > Will report-back after it's burned and booted.
> ________________
>
>
> I don't have any blank CDs so burned the ISO onto a DVD+RW disc
>
>
> Booted it up on this Intel i5 machine which has a SATA DVD+RW drive
>
> Chose the live option... result ...
>
> ERROR: Unable to initialize CD-ROM drive.
> A:\>
> ____________________________
>
> So, booted it on the Intel DualCore machine which also has a SATA DVD+RW
> drive.
>
> Chose the live option... result ...
>
> ERROR: Unable to initialize CD-ROM drive.
> A:\>
> ___________________________
>
> Will now try booting it on the old-as-dirt circa 1997 P-II machine
> which has an IDE/PATA DVD+RW drive.
>
> BRB
> ____________________________
>
>
>
> There we go... she's loading-up.
> (quite slowly 'cus this P-II is only 266Mhz and has only 512MB of RAM)
>
> OK.... loaded-up and sitting at....
>
> R:\>
>
> ____
>
> So, SATA DVD+RW drives seem to be a no-go.
>
> __________________
>
> Now sending this post to the FreeDOS sourceforge mailing list as-well.


Personally... I'd call this a 'beta' version or perhaps even 'alpha'
but most certainly not yet a 'release candidate' :(

---
--
http://glennmcc.org/

glennmcc

Homepage E-mail

North Jackson, Ohio (USA),
29.04.2021, 21:14

@ glennmcc
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> >
> > So, SATA DVD+RW drives seem to be a no-go.
> >
> > __________________

OK... this is not a new problem but rather is has been known
for some time that it's not compatible with SATA CD/DVD drives :(

http://www.z80.eu/freedoscd.html


Anyways.... I agree with Laaca that this 1.3RC is pretty-much useless as-is.

It's about the same as-if we had installed MS-DOS from its floppy set
'cus there's nothing included other than FreeDOS itself and a few 'utilities'.
(no additional programs that I can find)

---
--
http://glennmcc.org/

RayeR

Homepage

CZ,
30.04.2021, 14:59

@ glennmcc
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Yeah, it needs some more recent CD driver like GCDROM.SYS and AHCICD.SYS
http://rayer.g6.cz/download/download.htm#SATACD
Why is not included?

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

mceric

Germany,
30.04.2021, 19:00

@ RayeR
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> Yeah, it needs some more recent CD driver like GCDROM.SYS and AHCICD.SYS
> http://rayer.g6.cz/download/download.htm#SATACD
> Why is not included?

If you have looked at http://www.z80.eu/freedoscd.html

Note that this website is about FreeDOS 1.0 and not 1.3 ;-)

The current version includes UDVD2 which is quite recent,
but I still think it should also include ELTORITO as extra
driver to be used during the install itself, because that
would work on most systems with the help of the BIOS. The
UDVD2 driver is non-AHCI, but most SATA controllers can
be switched to non-AHCI mode in BIOS setup unless they
are very new.

What is the license of the AHCICD driver? Your download
says it is SHAREWARE by Rudolph Loew, but you have removed
the actual license text file. It is nice that sources and
a patch from Japheth are included, but if Rudolph changed
the license to something free, add a small text file about
that to the download.

Also, the download includes some encoded text file which
puzzles me. Adding headers and using uudecode, a binary
starting with "0GBZ" comes out, which seems to be packed
with something, but I do not know that magic or unpacker.

---
FreeDOS / DOSEMU2 / ...

Ringding

01.05.2021, 18:23

@ mceric
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> Also, the download includes some encoded text file which
> puzzles me. Adding headers and using uudecode, a binary
> starting with "0GBZ" comes out, which seems to be packed
> with something, but I do not know that magic or unpacker.

This is just a differently encoded copy of the original zip distribution. I have not been able to determine the exact encoding so far, though. It's likely somewhat related to ascii85.

tkchia

Homepage

01.05.2021, 20:21

@ Ringding
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Hello Ringding,

> This is just a differently encoded copy of the original zip distribution. I
> have not been able to determine the exact encoding so far, though. It's
> likely somewhat related to ascii85.

The R. Loew memorial home page has a REPACKER program that can decode this file: https://rloewelectronics.com/distribute/REPACKER .

(Edit: The .TXT file must have the original CRLF line endings for REPACKER to work.)

Thank you!

---
https://gitlab.com/tkchia · https://codeberg.org/tkchia · 😴 "MOV AX,0D500H+CMOS_REG_D+NMI"

mceric

Germany,
02.05.2021, 00:16

@ tkchia
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> The R. Loew memorial home page has a REPACKER program that can decode this
> file: https://rloewelectronics.com/distribute/REPACKER .

Thanks for the link! Here is a version which works in Linux:


#include <unistd.h>
#include <sys/types.h>
#include <sys/stat.h>
#include <fcntl.h>
#include <stdio.h>

#define st 34
#define sz 92

void cnvt (int n, unsigned char *b1, unsigned char *b2)
{
  unsigned int i, j, l, b;
  unsigned long x1, x2;
  unsigned char k[4];
  j = n * 52;
  for (i = 0; i < j; i++)
    b1[i] = 0;
  n <<= 4;
  for (b = i = j = 0; i < n; i++, b += 26)
    {
      x1 = b2[j + 3] - st;
      x2 = b2[j + 2] - st;
      x1 = (x1 * sz) + x2;
      x2 = b2[j + 1] - st;
      x1 = (x1 * sz) + x2;
      x2 = b2[j] - st;
      x1 = (x1 * sz) + x2;
      j += 4;
      l = b & 7;
      x1 = (x1 << 6) >> l;
      k[3] = b1[b >> 3];
      k[2] = b1[(b >> 3) + 1];
      k[1] = b1[(b >> 3) + 2];
      k[0] = b1[(b >> 3) + 3];
      *(long *) (&k) |= x1;
      b1[b >> 3] = k[3];
      b1[(b >> 3) + 1] = k[2];
      b1[(b >> 3) + 2] = k[1];
      b1[(b >> 3) + 3] = k[0];
      if ((i & 15) == 15)
        j += 2;
    }
}


int main (int c, char **v)
{
  unsigned long x, y, z;
  int f1, f2, i, j, k, l;
  unsigned char b1[13 * 512], b2[(16 * 512) + 256];
  if (c < 3)
    {
      printf ("REPACKER Source Dest\n");
      return (20);
    }
  f1 = open (v[1], 0);
  if (f1 < 0)
    {
      printf ("Cannot Open Source\n");
      return (20);
    }
  f2 = creat (v[2], 0);
  if (f2 < 0)
    {
      printf ("Cannot Create Dest\n");
      return (20);
    }
lp:
  i = read (f1, b2, (16 * 512) + 256);
  if (i == 0)
    return (0);
  j = i / 66;
  l = 0;
  if (b2[(j * 66) - 2] - 13)
    {
      l = b2[(j * 66) - 2] - st;
      l -= 52;
    }
  cnvt (j, b1, b2);
  k = (j * 52) + l;
  if (write (f2, b1, k) - k)
    goto werr;
  if (l == 0)
    goto lp;
  return (0);
werr:
  printf ("Write Error\n");
  return (20);
}


The (ZIP 2.0 deflate compressed) ZIP contains this:


2019-01-01 04:13:58 ....A         2064         1476  AHCICD.SYS
2019-01-05 01:04:28 ....A         5678         2683  LICENSE.TXT
2019-01-05 01:05:56 ....A          459          178  HISTORY.TXT
2019-01-05 01:07:40 ....A         7187         2925  README.TXT


All files apart from LICENSE.TXT are identical to what can be found directly in the download mentioned earlier, without having to REPACK the "AHCICD.TXT" into the original "AHCICD.ZIP". The LICENSE.TXT contains the following:


AHCI CD/DVD DOS Driver

Copyright (C) 2018-2019
by Rudolph R. Loew
All Rights Reserved.


LICENSE AGREEMENT:

LICENSE: Rudolph Loew grants you a nonexclusive license to use the
accompanying copyrighted software program(s) (the "SOFTWARE"), which
includes any associated software components, and any online or electronic
documentation, on a single Computer, subject to the terms and restrictions
set forth in this License Agreement.

For purposes of this Agreement, a single Computer means that you are only
able to use the Software on a single Computer at a time. You may Install the
AHCI Driver on a single Computer. If you want to transfer the Software to
another Computer, you must remove the AHCI Driver from the first Computer.

You are not permitted to sell or otherwise distribute any AHCI Driver Files,

You are not permitted to lease, rent, or sublicense the SOFTWARE, use the
SOFTWARE on more Computers than allowed by your license, or in any other
unauthorized manner. Further, no license is granted to you in the human
readable code of the SOFTWARE (source code). Except as provided below, this
License Agreement does not grant you any rights to patents, copyrights,
trade secrets, trademarks, or any other rights in respect to the SOFTWARE.

By installing, running, or otherwise using the SOFTWARE, you agree to be
bound by the terms of this License Agreement.

RESTRICTIONS: Modification, reverse engineering, reverse compiling, or
disassembly of the SOFTWARE is expressly prohibited, except and only to the
extent that such activity is expressly permitted by applicable law.
Disclosure of any details of the Software is expressly prohibited.

WARNING:

THE POTENTIAL EXISTS FOR DATA LOSS OR PERMANENT LOSS TO OCCUR DUE TO ERRORS
IN THE DRIVER OR IF THE DRIVER FILES ARE BYPASSED OR OVERWRITTEN. DO NOT USE
IN CRITICAL SYSTEMS OR WHERE HUMAN SAFETY IS INVOLVED.

NO WARRANTY: THE SOFTWARE AND DOCUMENTATION ARE PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS"
BASIS AND ALL RISK IS WITH YOU. RUDOLPH LOEW MAKES NO WARRANTIES,
EXPRESS, IMPLIED OR STATUTORY, AS TO ANY MATTER WHATSOEVER. IN
PARTICULAR, ANY AND ALL WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A
PARTICULAR PURPOSE OR NON-INFRINGEMENT OF THIRD PARTIES RIGHTS ARE
EXPRESSLY EXCLUDED. FURTHER, RUDOLPH LOEW MAKES NO REPRESENTATIONS OR
WARRANTIES THAT THE SOFTWARE AND DOCUMENTATION PROVIDED ARE FREE OF
ERRORS OR VIRUSES OR THAT THE SOFTWARE AND DOCUMENTATION ARE SUITABLE FOR
YOUR INTENDED USE.

LIMITATION OF LIABILITY: IN NO EVENT SHALL RUDOLPH LOEW OR HIS SUPPLIERS
BE LIABLE TO YOU OR ANY OTHER PARTY FOR ANY INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL OR
CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, LOSS OF DATA OR DATA BEING RENDERED INACCURATE,
LOSS OF PROFITS OR REVENUE, OR INTERRUPTION OF BUSINESS IN ANY WAY
ARISING OUT OF OR RELATED TO THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE
AND/OR DOCUMENTATION, REGARDLESS OF THE FORM OF ACTION, WHETHER IN
CONTRACT, TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE), STRICT PRODUCT LIABILITY OR
OTHERWISE, EVEN IF ANY REPRESENTATIVE OF RUDOLPH LOEW OR HIS SUPPLIERS
HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. THIS DISCLAIMER OF
LIABILITY FOR DAMAGES WILL NOT BE AFFECTED BY ANY FAILURE OF THE SOLE AND
EXCLUSIVE REMEDIES HEREUNDER.

EXPORT RULES: You agree that the SOFTWARE will not be shipped, transferred
or exported into any country or used in any manner prohibited by the United
States Export Administration Act or any other export laws, restrictions or
regulations (collectively the "Export Laws"). In addition, if the SOFTWARE
is identified as export controlled items under the Export Laws, you
represent and warrant that you are not a citizen, or otherwise located
within, an embargoed nation (including without limitation Iran, Iraq, Syria,
Sudan, Libya, Cuba, North Korea, and Serbia) and that you are not otherwise
prohibited under the Export Laws from receiving the SOFTWARE. All rights to
Use the SOFTWARE are granted on condition that such rights are forfeited if
you fail to comply with the terms of this Agreement.

GOVERNING LAW: This Agreement will be governed by and construed in accordance
with the laws in force of the State of New York. The respective courts of
Nassau County, New York shall have jurisdiction over all disputes relating
to this Agreement.

GENERAL PROVISIONS. If any part of this Agreement is found void and
unenforceable, it will not affect the validity of the balance of the
Agreement, which shall remain valid and enforceable according to its terms.
This Agreement shall not prejudice the statutory rights of any party dealing
as a consumer. This Agreement may only be modified by a writing signed by
Rudolph Loew. Updates may be licensed to you by Rudolph Loew with additional
or different terms. This is the entire agreement between Rudolph Loew and
you relating to the SOFTWARE and it supersedes any prior representations,
discussions, undertakings, communications or advertising relating to the
SOFTWARE.

MODIFICATIONS: Prices and Terms may change at any time. Download the current
Version of the test Program from http://rloew1.no-ip.com.

Compliance with Licenses. If you are a business or organization, you agree
that upon request from Rudolph Loew or his authorised representative, you
will within thirty (30) days fully document and certify that use of any and
all SOFTWARE at the time of the request is in conformity with your valid
licenses from Rudolph Loew.

Should you have any questions concerning this License Agreement, or if
you desire to contact Rudolph Loew for any reason, please contact
Rudolph Loew by electronic mail at: rloew thatcharacter hotmail.com.


(I have inserted "thatcharacter" instead of the at sign into the last line of the license text to keep the BTTR forum from making the email clickable and spammable)

However, remember that the rloewelectronics.com website says:


WELCOME
To the memorial homepage of
R. Loew Electronics Consulting
Rudolph Loew (Rudy) passed away on September 11th, 2019.
This site is maintained by his family to archive his work and make it available to anyone who is interested in pursuing further endeavors. You can view the original un-modified site here. Please do not try to make any purchases, all of Rudy's projects will be made available (including source code) as time permits.


The driver can also be downloaded on:

https://rloewelectronics.com/distribute/AHCICD/1.1/

It should be feasible to get some confirmation that the license no longer applies and include that in a package which can be distributed for example as part of a FreeDOS distro. Would be nice to have an open source AHCI driver with a free open source license. Maybe MIT or BSD? The disclaimer on the website sounds a bit like "public domain" but it would be nice to still remember the original author.

---
FreeDOS / DOSEMU2 / ...

Ringding

03.05.2021, 17:22

@ tkchia
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> The R. Loew memorial home page has a REPACKER program that can decode this
> file: https://rloewelectronics.com/distribute/REPACKER .

I actually went through these in the hopes of finding something like that, but because this particular one has no description in the table of contents, I missed it somehow. ;-)

So this method encodes groups of 26 bits into 4 ASCII characters, where each place in the resulting ASCII string can be one out of an alphabet of 92 characters – this is what the encoder does; the decoder, which REPACKER.C constitutes, does the opposite, obviously. An alphabet size of 91 would actually be enough to cover the entire value range of 26 bits. Although nothing would be gained from using 91; the highest value used is 125 now, so there would even be room for one or two more, but 127 might be problematic, so in reality just one.

So you might call it "Base92". It is obviously slightly more efficient than the somewhat widely used "Base85" (23% size increase vs. 25%).

Ringding

03.05.2021, 20:36

@ Ringding
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

This reproduces the function of REPACK.C in Python:

import sys
def main():
    outl = []
    bb = b"".join(open(sys.argv[1], "rb").read().split(b"\r\n"))
    for p in range(0, len(bb)-1, 16):
        t = bb[p:p+16]
        d = 0
        for n in range(4):
            v = 0
            for m in reversed(t[:4]):
                v = v*92 + m-34
            d = (d<<26) + v
            t = t[4:]
        outl.append(d.to_bytes(13, "big"))
    lcorr = bb[-1]-34-52
    assert lcorr<0
    open(sys.argv[2], "wb").write(b"".join(outl)[:lcorr])
main()

RayeR

Homepage

CZ,
03.05.2021, 22:49

@ mceric
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> What is the license of the AHCICD driver? Your download
> says it is SHAREWARE by Rudolph Loew, but you have removed
> the actual license text file.

R.Loew has passed away. His family put his work including some (not all) sources online for free use. AFAIK no exact licence was specified as probably they are not so educated about tons of license types. I just guess they made it free in sense to be used and modified by community for non-commercial usage.

Not all AHCI systems have compatability mode, better say that most of recent systems don't have such option anymore so AHCI driver is a must to have feature. BTW it would be nice to made an universal driver that could detect IDE and AHCI compatible controllers and use automatically what's avaialble.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

glennmcc

Homepage E-mail

North Jackson, Ohio (USA),
01.05.2021, 18:26

@ RayeR
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

> Yeah, it needs some more recent CD driver like GCDROM.SYS and AHCICD.SYS
> http://rayer.g6.cz/download/download.htm#SATACD
> Why is not included?

Well, even if a driver were included for accessing SATA CD/DVD drives...
Laaca's initial disappointment still stands in-that the live option is pretty-much useless. :(

---
--
http://glennmcc.org/

Laaca

Homepage

Czech republic,
29.04.2021, 23:04

@ Laaca
 

Disgusted by FreeDOS 1.3RC installation CD

Well, I wrote quite crititical review about FreeDOS 1.3rc. It was reposted into FreeDOS user forum and was few times commented and it is of course commented also here.
Just to be clear - I don't complain about DOS as such but specificaly about FreeDOS 1.3rc and mainly about installer.
I will try to summarize my criticism into several categories:
1) Missing DOS/FreeDOS features
2) FreeDOS live system from CD
3) FreeDOS installation
4) Help system
5) Packages

ad 1) Here is not much to say. I miss some feature in modern DOS system but it is not fault of the FreeDOS community. I would like to see a better LFN driver, better disk read/write/seek performance (much worse than f.e. under Win98). We do not have a good ASPI driver we do not have a good task switcher and so on and so on. But again, this is not the point of my criticism.

ad 2) Why the booting starts with unzipping of many basic utilities like ATTRIB.ZIP, FORMAT.ZIP, COMP.ZIP and so on. Why it just does not unzip something like BASE.ZIP which would contain all this basic utilities? You forgot how slow is the file seeking on the CD on the real hardware? Sure, the contiuous read is fast on most of CD drives but seeking and opening the large amount of small files is a pain.
And after this we have only very bare system with only few applications/utilities. It is much worse than very ancient Live CD of FreeDOS 0.9a which I have and occasionaly use (although it is also a .BAT files complicated mess). In 0.9 it ended in rather primitive menu system but working system which allowed many tasks. Even much better is Hiren boot CD. I heard that it is based on Linux or Windows. But I have a completely different experience. I have a older version (Hiren 9.5?) which is DOS based. The boot proces ends in quite nice menu sorted into categories and subcategories which instantly allow quite wide spectrum of useful things what to do in DOS.

ad 3) Installer should be generaly much more user friendly and should inform a user about the process. It would be nice if it could perform a system scan in the begining and resume the system from point of view of DOS compatibility.
Like "Warning, no IDE/ATAPI interface, optical drives will not work" or "Your processor does not support a 32-bit protected mode - the install set will be adjusted for it".
In case when some existing disk partitions are present it should offer the installation of boot manager (preferably BootMGR by BTTR software). FDisk should be replaced by some better alternative.
Also - the user should be prompted to choose a variant of installation (very basic, extended, full) and also a list of desired applications via a expandable list for custom modifications of the options above.
I like the point that current installer creates a multi configuration FDCONFIG.SYS. It is important because on the tested notebook (Dell Latitude 610) the first two options did not work for me and only the other options were working.
And finally - after the installation must be displayed (and also saved into some protocol file) some summarization of whole process.


ad 4) Help system must be totaly reworked. After writing "help" should be displayed some overview like:
* FreeDOS core files and installed into C:\ and C:\FDOS\BIN. Other available disks are: .....
* For your convience are prepared these BAT scripts
- for filemanager write "dz"
- for system info write "sysinfo"
- for more info about applications in C:\EDITORS write "help editors"
- for more info about applications in C:\SOUND\ write "help sound"
...
- for more info about DOS core utils and DOS batch language write "help dos"

ad 5) In harddisk mode and live CD mode must be easily available utilities for system informations, disk/file recovery utilities, BIOS tools and so on. Because it is still a traditional playfield for DOS systems.
Also some picture viewer and converter should be available even in the basic installations. Mpxplay also could be also in basic installations.
It is also wise to have a special C:\KOMP\ directory (listed in PATH variable) where are all file archivers like ZIPINFO, UNRAR, 7ZIP,....
I like the quite rich \UTIL\ directory on the installation CD but it must be somehow sorted. Idealy combined with something like DESCRIPT.ION files.
There must be some discussion which programs are missing (some painting programs like GrafX, PictView, SEA?...). And maybe some programs could be removed from distro? (B64?)
Very controversal point is the mania to install all applications into universal directories like \BIN\, \APPINFO\ etc.
If everything will be installed into C:\BIN, terrible mess will happen

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DOS-u-akbar!

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